Musical Theatre Colleges with additional studies

[ChrisBu]

Hi all,

 

I'm new to posting in this forum so I hope I am posting this in the correct place.

 

My daughter has just started Year 11 and has a massive passion for Musical Theatre. She does tap, ballet and modern dance as well as private singing lessons and performed in various local shows and pantomimes. She has been with NYMT and English Youth Ballet and will start associates with Emil Dale soon.

 

We are torn between MT colleges at 16 or holding fire until 18 so she can do A-levels first. I know Tring offer MT with A-levels as well... as do Hammond. Are there any others that offer this? 

 

Another option are online A-levels to work on alongside MT college - does anyone have any experience of doing this and have any recommendation of online A-level providers?

 

Many thanks for your help.

 

Chris.

[Jan McNulty]

Hello @ChrisBu and welcome to the Forum!

[taxi4ballet]

It would be worth her auditioning for both Tring and Hammond as a career in the performing arts is an uncertain one at best, and it would be really good if she gets some A-levels as a Plan B. On the whole, if she isn't accepted by either of those (and remember their 6th form will be mostly already filled by their Y11s going up), then it would be best for her to stay at academic school for A-levels and wait and audition for MT colleges such as Laine, Bird etc etc for 18+. The majority of students don't start at those till they are 18 anyway. Emil Dales associates will prepare her for that.

 

Has she ever done any of the Tring workshops, short courses or summer schools?

[ChrisBu]

4 minutes ago, taxi4ballet said:

It would be worth her auditioning for both Tring and Hammond as a career in the performing arts is an uncertain one at best, and it would be really good if she gets some A-levels as a Plan B. On the whole, if she isn't accepted by either of those (and remember their 6th form will be mostly already filled by their Y11s going up), then it would be best for her to stay at academic school for A-levels and wait and audition for MT colleges such as Laine, Bird etc etc for 18+. The majority of students don't start at those till they are 18 anyway. Emil Dales associates will prepare her for that.

 

Has she ever done any of the Tring workshops, short courses or summer schools?

Many thanks for the reply and information.

 

She hasn't done anything with Tring at all and if I'm being honest the £45k+ per year is going to be out of our reach sadly. 

 

We have a local option at D16 which offers an Edexcel BTEC Level 3 Extended Diploma but, as parents, we do feel that she may be better suited to study A-levels and continue with her dance, singing and associates classes and then focus more on MT colleges when she's 18. I think her worry is she will be left behind if she doesn't study MT/dance as soon as she leaves school at 16. It's so difficult - which is why I'm trying to explore if there's a blend that can be found.

[balletbean]

1 hour ago, ChrisBu said:

Many thanks for the reply and information.

 

She hasn't done anything with Tring at all and if I'm being honest the £45k+ per year is going to be out of our reach sadly. 

 

We have a local option at D16 which offers an Edexcel BTEC Level 3 Extended Diploma but, as parents, we do feel that she may be better suited to study A-levels and continue with her dance, singing and associates classes and then focus more on MT colleges when she's 18. I think her worry is she will be left behind if she doesn't study MT/dance as soon as she leaves school at 16. It's so difficult - which is why I'm trying to explore if there's a blend that can be found.

Hi. Just thought I would jump in here. The biggest difference is funding. DaDa for 16yr olds but not guaranteed as each school/college has limited amount. Student loan for post 18 like other degree students. 
A Diploma Level 6 fees are noticeably more than a BA(Hons) as those fees are set across the board. 
MT isn’t so age focused as the ballet world. 
So please reassure your daughter she won’t be missing out by not going at 16.
  
Can also be emotionally challenging as well but then no two teenagers are alike however when the majority of an MT cohort is 18 and only a few are 16 at some of the big names colleges you can soon appreciate how that can happen. Some insist that their 16yr olds stay with host families whilst the older students live independently. Not saying it doesn’t work as there’s plenty that have gone down this route but just something to consider when looking. 
My daughters have kindly put me through the experience of both MT at 18 and Ballet/Jazz at 16. I’ve learnt a lot. 
A levels as others have said is worth considering whilst maintaining dance training. 
Happy to answer any questions you may have if I can. 🙂

Ps. MT summer schools are definitely worth applying for. If you are careful on the dates and funds allow it maybe possible to attend 2 each summer. Getting your face seen before the audition season and of course gaining a greater insight whether to  include or even exclude when making that final decision. 

Edited September 10 by balletbean

[Farawaydancer]

We’ve just gone through this decision making process this year. Dd has left her vocational school in order to do A levels and then will decide at 18 whether to go back to dance. Some of that was finance-driven but mostly it was about keeping the best possible options open, in a way which she couldn’t have done if she’d gone to do a dance diploma. 

[ChrisBu]

3 hours ago, balletbean said:

Hi. Just thought I would jump in here. The biggest difference is funding. DaDa for 16yr olds but not guaranteed as each school/college has limited amount. Student loan for post 18 like other degree students. 
A Diploma Level 6 fees are noticeably more than a BA(Hons) as those fees are set across the board. 
MT isn’t so age focused as the ballet world. 
So please reassure your daughter she won’t be missing out by not going at 16.
  
Can also be emotionally challenging as well but then no two teenagers are alike however when the majority of an MT cohort is 18 and only a few are 16 at some of the big names colleges you can soon appreciate how that can happen. Some insist that their 16yr olds stay with host families whilst the older students live independently. Not saying it doesn’t work as there’s plenty that have gone down this route but just something to consider when looking. 
My daughters have kindly put me through the experience of both MT at 18 and Ballet/Jazz at 16. I’ve learnt a lot. 
A levels as others have said is worth considering whilst maintaining dance training. 
Happy to answer any questions you may have if I can. 🙂

Ps. MT summer schools are definitely worth applying for. If you are careful on the dates and funds allow it maybe possible to attend 2 each summer. Getting your face seen before the audition season and of course gaining a greater insight whether to  include or even exclude when making that final decision. 

That's really helpful thanks - yes moving out when she's barely turned 16 and 100's of miles away is a tough thing to consider - for everyone! Likewise she is thinking that a fulltime BTEC Diploma where she can stay at home is an option. I just think that A-levels (whilst continuing dance & singing training and Emil Dale associates) may be a better route especially as she's a bright girl! Then she is also not putting all her eggs in one basket. Argggh! 

 

Thank you so much - I'll definitely come back to you if I have any questions  

[ChrisBu]

55 minutes ago, Farawaydancer said:

We’ve just gone through this decision making process this year. Dd has left her vocational school in order to do A levels and then will decide at 18 whether to go back to dance. Some of that was finance-driven but mostly it was about keeping the best possible options open, in a way which she couldn’t have done if she’d gone to do a dance diploma. 

I'm totally onboard with this - thank you for making me realise we're not alone going through this!!  

[Flower]

Are you close enough to Birmingham to try for BOA? They offer a btec in MF and 2 A levels (from a small selection) alongside. State school so free.

[Flower]

5 hours ago, balletbean said:

Hi. Just thought I would jump in here. The biggest difference is funding. DaDa for 16yr olds but not guaranteed as each school/college has limited amount. Student loan for post 18 like other degree students. 
A Diploma Level 6 fees are noticeably more than a BA(Hons) as those fees are set across the board. 
MT isn’t so age focused as the ballet world. 
So please reassure your daughter she won’t be missing out by not going at 16.
  
Can also be emotionally challenging as well but then no two teenagers are alike however when the majority of an MT cohort is 18 and only a few are 16 at some of the big names colleges you can soon appreciate how that can happen. Some insist that their 16yr olds stay with host families whilst the older students live independently. Not saying it doesn’t work as there’s plenty that have gone down this route but just something to consider when looking. 
My daughters have kindly put me through the experience of both MT at 18 and Ballet/Jazz at 16. I’ve learnt a lot. 
A levels as others have said is worth considering whilst maintaining dance training. 
Happy to answer any questions you may have if I can. 🙂

Ps. MT summer schools are definitely worth applying for. If you are careful on the dates and funds allow it maybe possible to attend 2 each summer. Getting your face seen before the audition season and of course gaining a greater insight whether to  include or even exclude when making that final decision. 

Ballet bean we are looking at dance places for 16+ would tou mind sharing some of the downsides please? Happy to be private messaged. X

[ChrisBu]

9 hours ago, Flower said:

Are you close enough to Birmingham to try for BOA? They offer a btec in MF and 2 A levels (from a small selection) alongside. State school so free.

We're not - but I will take a look at this - thank you for this!  

[ChrisBu]

9 hours ago, Flower said:

Ballet bean we are looking at dance places for 16+ would tou mind sharing some of the downsides please? Happy to be private messaged. X

Share with me as well please!!  

[Pointetoes]

My DD was under a lot of pressure from her school to stay on and do A levels, she was a straight A/A* student. She knew she wanted to go into the world of performing arts. We were lucky in that there is a local vocational 6th so she went there. She did Extended Diploma in Performing Arts and got triple D* ( Distinction* equivalent to A* at A level and the same number of Ucas points )

It was the best decision we could have made. Not only was she incredibly happy but it didn't rule out university. One of the best bits of advice she got from her academic school dance teacher was to do a degree not a diploma because a degree is a degree and it opens up so many doors.

She went on to GSA ( Guildford School of Acting) and did Actor Muso degree. There were a lot on her course, the MT course and the acting course who all did Betel extended diploma rather than A levels

[meadowblythe]

@Pointetoes what a lovely post!  My non dancing son did the production arts equivalent, and again never looked back (although he was not academic, whatever his other qualities!) 

 

Has your daughter completed her degree?  I want to know what happened next!

 

Meadowblythe

[Pointetoes]

@meadowblythe thank you!

 

She graduated 2 years ago and is currently in rehearsals for a tour of The Shelfish Giant. Like your son, she has never looked back.

[Harwel]

From my experience make sure you are led by your DC.  Obviously, as the adult in the relationship you are able to see things from a broader perspective and can help them weigh up the pros and cons of either situation.  I have 2 sons, one went to Tring on the dancers course at 14, he stayed for 6th form and was adamant he didn’t want to do A’levels as wanted to concentrate fully on dance.  Nothing we said could have made him change his mind.  He ended up having to have 2 hip surgeries and by 3rd year upper school realised he was going to have to change track.  He did 2 A’levels in a year, achieved his Level 6 diploma in professional dance then embarked on an apprenticeship scheme to become a project manager with building surveying.  He is now fully qualified with degree (all funded for him) Rics qualified and 5 years work experience.  If your child is bright, industrious and hard working they will achieve no matter what. 
 

My youngest son left school after GCSE, went to Emil Dale for BTECH, now going into 3rd year at GSA MT degree. In his holidays he has worked for his dad and trained in Hearcare and wax removal and does that as a muggle job.  Only time will tell what life has in store for him but wild horses would never have got him to do A’levels but I have absolutely no doubt he will make a success of his life which ever path he ends up taking. 

[Harwel]

Sorry had to rush off before finishing my thoughts - my DS who is at GSA says the vast majority of his year either did BTECH or did a foundation year before embarking on the degree.  Some with BTECH also had to do a foundation year to get their dream school.  Only 1 student got straight in from A’levels and while very talented, my DS thought this person had a long way to go to catch up with the rest of the year.  Things like stamina, quick turn over of learning lines and Songs all took a while to gel for that student as they hadn’t been immersed in full time training previously.  This also takes an emotional toll to always be on catch up. 

[ChrisBu]

1 hour ago, Harwel said:

Sorry had to rush off before finishing my thoughts - my DS who is at GSA says the vast majority of his year either did BTECH or did a foundation year before embarking on the degree.  Some with BTECH also had to do a foundation year to get their dream school.  Only 1 student got straight in from A’levels and while very talented, my DS thought this person had a long way to go to catch up with the rest of the year.  Things like stamina, quick turn over of learning lines and Songs all took a while to gel for that student as they hadn’t been immersed in full time training previously.  This also takes an emotional toll to always be on catch up. 

This is really helpful - thank you so much.

[Pointetoes]

1 hour ago, Harwel said:

Sorry had to rush off before finishing my thoughts - my DS who is at GSA says the vast majority of his year either did BTECH or did a foundation year before embarking on the degree.  Some with BTECH also had to do a foundation year to get their dream school.  Only 1 student got straight in from A’levels and while very talented, my DS thought this person had a long way to go to catch up with the rest of the year.  Things like stamina, quick turn over of learning lines and Songs all took a while to gel for that student as they hadn’t been immersed in full time training previously.  This also takes an emotional toll to always be on catch up. 

My DD who is a GSA grad completely agrees with this.

 

She also says that each place knows what they are looking for. If you get a no remember its not because you are not good enough its because you aren't right for that place or course. The same goes with being offered a Foundation course over a degree course. Its not a no its simply we think you would benefit from a bit more training before starting a 3 year course 

[taxi4ballet]

7 hours ago, Harwel said:

...and does that as a muggle job.  

I like that description!

[Harwel]

31 minutes ago, taxi4ballet said:

I like that description!

It’s fun isn’t it?  They all seem to use this description. 

[MrsMoo2]

My daughter has just started at LIPA VIth form in Liverpool and we are impressed so far. If you’re anywhere near Liverpool it’s a great option…👍👍

[balletbean]

On 12/09/2024 at 12:55, Pointetoes said:

 

 

She also says that each place knows what they are looking for. If you get a no remember its not because you are not good enough its because you aren't right for that place or course.  

Wise words. Also helpful to apply a similar mindset when out in the professional world auditioning for that next contract, building on one’s resilience to keep going. Which as we know every dancer needs in bucket loads. 

[SW mum]

To add to the other thoughts. My daughter was in a similar situation . She stayed at her local 6th form college and did A levels and then applied to different dance schools. She is at LSC  now where she will (hopefully!) get a degree and also have her A levels to fall back on if necessary.
While doing her A levels she did associate  classes at the weekend as well as her normal dance school classes. They were miles away so it meant lots of travelling but it was worth it especially if they are classes at the schools you would consider.
I would caution that it takes a lot of commitment from everybody: financial, taxi service, studying in the car, potentially missing out going out with friends etc. other children but it was definitely the correct decision for us.
As has already been said it does depend on your child and their determination, and also the quality of your local dance/theatre school, how near you are to associate programmes. I do think Musical Theatre is slightly different from  straight dance in terms of studying at 16 or 18. 
Leaving home at 16 (depending on the child) is a big ask especially if they will need to cook/shop/ wash etc for themselves - as well as dancing full time.

Just a few thoughts.. not necessarily helpful but maybe things to think about. 

 

[ChrisBu]

22 hours ago, SW mum said:

To add to the other thoughts. My daughter was in a similar situation . She stayed at her local 6th form college and did A levels and then applied to different dance schools. She is at LSC  now where she will (hopefully!) get a degree and also have her A levels to fall back on if necessary.
While doing her A levels she did associate  classes at the weekend as well as her normal dance school classes. They were miles away so it meant lots of travelling but it was worth it especially if they are classes at the schools you would consider.
I would caution that it takes a lot of commitment from everybody: financial, taxi service, studying in the car, potentially missing out going out with friends etc. other children but it was definitely the correct decision for us.
As has already been said it does depend on your child and their determination, and also the quality of your local dance/theatre school, how near you are to associate programmes. I do think Musical Theatre is slightly different from  straight dance in terms of studying at 16 or 18. 
Leaving home at 16 (depending on the child) is a big ask especially if they will need to cook/shop/ wash etc for themselves - as well as dancing full time.

Just a few thoughts.. not necessarily helpful but maybe things to think about. 

 

Definitely helpful - thank you very much!

[Dancemums]

This resonates so much with my family.  Our DD in Year 13 is doing A levels to give her something to fall back on if anything happens: injuries are an ever-present risk and the industry can be extremely tough at the best of times.  She has been doing MT summer schools at the colleges she is interested in applying for, plus associate schemes, intensives and special events. These activities, combined with her dance school classes and singing lessons, are manageable alongside her school life and, to be honest, I think not being totally immersed in performance all the time and having friends who don't sing/dance has been really good for her.  Helps keep everything in perspective!  

[balletbean]

On 17/09/2024 at 10:27, Dancemums said:

This resonates so much with my family.  Our DD in Year 13 is doing A levels to give her something to fall back on if anything happens: injuries are an ever-present risk and the industry can be extremely tough at the best of times.  She has been doing MT summer schools at the colleges she is interested in applying for, plus associate schemes, intensives and special events. These activities, combined with her dance school classes and singing lessons, are manageable alongside her school life and, to be honest, I think not being totally immersed in performance all the time and having friends who don't sing/dance has been really good for her.  Helps keep everything in perspective!  

Hi. This might also be helpful to @SW mum  
 

Best wishes to your DD, exciting times ahead. From a mum with a DD out there in the industry (dancer not MT) and having followed the audition circuit covering many opportunities,  I would suggest to anyone now to consider looking at other skills beyond the usual MT.
 

What would make your DD stand out that little bit more to others at an audition or when submitting the cv and showreel to a company or Agent.  Many of these might not be offered at the MT schools and colleges ie Acro (solo/partner), Silks, Aerial work and with the revival of Starlight Express, how about roller skating? The latter being a very scary thought I know. 
 

And finally looking ahead and may seem so far away but one to be mindful of. 

If anyone is looking at working outside the UK, do keep a close eye on the expiry date of the passport especially if they still hold a child’s passport which only lasts 5yrs. DD’s passport wasn’t due to expire for another 13months which would have ticked all the boxes for standard tourist requirements but decided to renew early. She was so pleased she did as when a contract came through the length of the contract would have crossed over the expiry date of the passport whilst overseas potentially creating so much hassle. New passport also ensured that the visa application process was completed swiftly. Easy to overlook when there are loads of other things to focus on when they graduate. 🌍
 

Edited yesterday at 15:56 by balletbean