Ondine

I went to a Saturday matinee October 31st 1998 Les Patineurs, Birthday Offering, Enigma Variations. Heady days when Ashton wasn't a rarity! Can't recall who was dancing, must look it up. I vividly remember a building not quite completed, with bare wires dangling overhead where light fittings were missing.

No I understood what you said. I was making the point that too often parents in ballet are portrayed as older than they possibly should be. I mentioned Fille and I mentioned Alain as there is discussion of Alain further up the thread. Presumably Alain and Lise are of similar age, and both young. i've not equated him to the groom in Les Noces, other than both possibly being young. Not that any of it matters as it's all pure fiction anyhow.

She married at 16. She was apparently very beautiful. She was not quite 21 when she had Rudolf, her third child. He was thirty at the time of his death.

No I read what you wrote and understood what you meant. I was being a tad lighthearted, but it does irritate me when say, Giselle's mother is portrayed as someone who could be her gran. Eh? Alain may not be 'ready' but his father and Widow Simone have the wedding all arranged. That's the pivotal point of the story. Sadly, Lise is rather 'badly guarded' and so... A Wiki's synposis has it Not finding anywhere suitable in the living room, Lise takes Colas to her room, and she returns to the living room just before Widow Simone enters the house. The Widow Simone orders Lise to go to her room and put on her wedding dress for her forthcoming marriage to Alain. The horrified Lise tries to remain where she is, but the Widow Simone pushes Lise into her room and locks the door. Thomas arrives with his son Alain (who is still clutching his umbrella). They are accompanied by a notary who is to act as witness to the marriage. The farm workers (friends of both Lise and Colas) also arrive. The Widow Simone gives Alain the key to Lise's room. When Alain unlocks the door to Lise's room, Lise appears in her wedding dress, accompanied by Colas. Thomas and Alain take offence, and the enraged Thomas tears up the marriage contract. Thomas, Alain and the notary leave the house in dudgeon.

Except in Ye Olden Days parents did tend to be young as people got married young. Juliet? 14? Aurora? In modern productions she's 16? GIselle? Nutcracker, the parents have young children? Les Noces? How old are the couple getting hitched? Children would rapidly follow. Then there's Fille, how old do we reckon Lise is? Young enough to be put over her mother's knee and spanked. Young enough to be locked in the house by her mother. (That's the mother played by a burly bloke.) Child abuse. Alain is portrayed as being young. And so, playing parents as old and slow is rather odd.

It's not only the dancers. The sets, lighting, props, costumes, orchestra, conductors... the logistics of doing those side by side? Horrific!

Oh do carry on dribbling. Please! Here's a little glimpse of Mira Nadon.

I think you've put it in a nutshell there. RAD is syllabus, which changes. Cecchetti is a method, a way of training the body, moving, of placing the body, and so much more. It's actually not simple to explain but once you have tried it, as I said a long way back... Stork and butter. 😌

Yes. I posted it for the initial posts relevant to this discussion, but I note it went on to wider issues including a moan about Wayne McGregor. Certainly some things don't change.

Yes I posted that earlier. Some things don't change!

This is new to me, apologies if it has already been posted elsewhere. The ISTD Academy. https://www.istd.org/discover/news/introducing-the-istd-academy/ Whether you’re an experienced teacher, a professional dancer or recent dance graduate you can progress your career with the Level 6 DDP teaching qualification. This course provides non syllabus, non genre specific training for you to enhance your teaching skills and maximise opportunities to develop your career in the state or private sector with a route to applying for Qualified Teacher Learning and Skills Status (QTLS). Taught by leading practitioners, the course is delivered remotely allowing you flexibility to learn and work. Further courses to come. ISTD Academy is a subsidiary of the charity ISTD (Registered charity no. 250397) so while its part of the ISTD family, it is a separate entity delivering teacher training.

That's because those are easy to revive, many company dancers who know the roles already and people who can rehearse them without too much work and trouble researching!

I suspect the corps get tired, I think the snowflake scene is what is technically, in ballet terms, known as knackering. As for the rest, roles appear to be fairly well shared out, with great choreography for principals, soloists, character artists, small group dances as well as Sugar Plum and her prince. It's a great chance for many to shine.

TERRIFYING!

From 2008 on Ballet Alert. It's related to this discussion. https://balletalert.invisionzone.com/topic/28293-british-schools-foreign-born-dancers/ I know Nureyev was a 'permanent guest artist' and maybe that's how the company employed those not British born or from the Commonwealth?

Apologies missed that and too late to add to previous post. These are basically competitive awards for those who are keen to show what they can do to an audience and be judged. There are prizes. Always nice to take part for those who enjoy performing, and even better to win a prize. Good to put on a CV. Great to get a bursary for further training. These are separate from the exam system, though of course they are open to those who have taken Cecchetti exams and in training with a Cecchetti teacher. https://www.cecchettisocietytrust.org/vocational-awards-2022/23 https://www.istd.org/discover/news/cecchetti-classical-ballet-awards-2022/ There is also an Associates scheme, which possibly should be more widely known. Open to all with talent who wish to widen their dance experience. https://www.cecchettiassociates.dance/

I'd argue much of what we now consider the 'English' style is actually based on Cecchetti work (passed on from his teachers) and his method, as passed on to those who founded British ballet! de Valois, Rambert, Ashton... As for how it 'works' at the moment re practical training, it's been rejigged via the ISTD to align with other ways of training. There are grades leading to what we used to call 'majors' now 'vocational' where students are in the exam room with the examiner and the music, either singly or very mall groups. There are 'class' exams where a small class of students go in to the exam and are guided through work with their teacher. The emphasis is on enjoyment and dancing as a hobby. Many students do a mix of grade and class exams. Both give sound training in the basics of the Cecchetti style & work in the hands of a good teacher to lead up to the 'majors'. The Diploma is a stand alone exam.

I don't think all dancers in the RB companies came from Commonwealth countries, and though there was a time when I think all had to spend a short time at the school it was a nod rather than years of training.

Two quick thoughts. I do wonder if the Les Noces centenary had actually been simply forgotten until rumblings of discontent brought it to the attention of Kevin O'Hare, at which point of course it was far too late to schedule and revive and rehearse and cast and stage it. It isn't something can be thrown together quickly. It's not been in the rep for a considerable time. I'm not even sure who could stage it, Monica Mason has of course danced in it. Hence the nod in its direction with the Clore event, which is better than nothing I suppose. Not great but something. I think to do it justice would have meant a number of associated events and other revived works, audience education, dancer education, exhibitions, publicity. Clearly other things were in the pipeline which couldn't be dropped. Nutcracker. I think the chance for the students from White Lodge and Upper School to dance plays a major part in why it re-appears year after year. Those students don't actually get many performance opportunities with the company, especially White Lodgers. Coppelia and Alice have both been tried but I suspect again, there were rumblings of discontent. So it's become the annual tradition. It's not actually a bad one IMO. Yes bums on seats, but also audience building and many roles for company members. I'm mentally processing the rest of your post @FLOSS

This too is shocking. I simply don't know what to say. This means an academic pathway to dance related career is shut off too. I'd have thought a student attaining a degree could be chalked up as a success to the school. It's good to have all this out in the open really.

The POB system is worth looking at via the website, for year on year admission, from aged eight with compulsory part time boarding, for an initial six months training. For those youngsters there also has to be a responsible adult living close by. https://www.operadeparis.fr/en/artists/ballet-school/admission The intake is a year at a time, with a competitive exam to move on to another year. No idea what happens to those who don't pass a year though they can go away and re-apply another year. What I'd be interested to know is what percentage of those who train there actually make it through to pass the competition to join the corps each year, though I believe that dancers in the POB are also compulsorily 'retired' quite early to make room for those arriving at the 'bottom' of the company? I also wonder what happens to those students who don't make the corps. However, given the 'sifting out' which happens all the way through presumably those who do make it this far are well trained and good dancers. I'm assuming all this is state funded, which not all students at the RBS are. I don't think the POB has ever been an international company in the way the British companies are.

Exactly. Why accept a student only to treat him or her badly? It's so distressing reading all this. No young person should have their life blighted in this way. Even if not the most talented in the group, to have got this far surely means ability way, way above the average? Praise and some positivity and help is what teachers are actually paid to do. A little extra coaching, some love.

That's shocking. Dreadful. Needs to change.

I don't know how much feedback is given to anyone 'assessed out'. I'm assuming there must be some. A jury with a marking system, a subjective opinion... neither are infallible sadly.

Is White Lodge fully funded for all? Is there an element of a sliding scale, a means test? I thought there was. I haven't actually delved into all the means and ways that the RB schools are funded, but I suspect it's complex and doesn't totally rely on the taxpayer. Also as a number of arts orgs have discovered, what can be given can also be taken away. I agree the welfare of students is the main thrust of the discussion, but one of the stresses seems to be 'assessing out' and maybe holding the POB system up as a better example doesn't bear a great deal of scrutiny as each year there are competitive exams. Fail and you're out. You also of course have to compete to get into the corps, and to be promoted once in the company.