Neverdancedjustamum

Current London Mids (MA1) had until 28th March to decline their offer of another year’s training. However, I think other centres had their assessments later and so that might have pushed back their deadline to respond a bit later too.

Hi! Yes, I still have 9, 10, 11, 12, 16 and 21.

Congratulation to your DC! Despite all the things on this thread it’s a major feat and achievement being offered a place at the RBS. It’s such a high profile school internationally that I must admit it’s very very rare that a DC and parents opt to go elsewhere given the chance. But as you said, it’s good to go into these things with eyes open and be able to weigh the pros and cons (and prioritising the child’s well-being). It’s a huge commitment of a child’s life and it’s always tricky to know what they want at that age and at the same time even if you see them every week, that’s still a lot of your DC’s life that will be spent away from you during his/her formative years (if DC is to board). In addition to the number of Y9s getting places at Y10, do also consider the number of Y11s who get an upper school place, bearing in mind how many of those have been there since Y7. The story might be quite telling. Finally check the stats on the second year uppers who get offered the final year at upper school and then final year on to Company. Again, check how many have been there from Y7. And remember there’s always lots of roads learning to a DC’s goal and the one that’s most obvious might not always be the best.

That does seem quite a lot of girls compared to previous years. I must admit that as an outsider with no first hand experience, when I heard about the new structure the first thing that came to mind was that it will give the school more leeway and justification to let a lot more students go at the end of Y9. Cynical I know but that’s really what came to mind immediately. You can see from the numbers the previous poster mentioned - the number of girls is significantly more than previous years. Could be coincidence, I don’t know, but the next few years will tell. I just saw on social media a 12 year old international (summer birthday too so very young in the year if she were in the U.K.) has just been offered a Y10 place. That’s almost skipping 2 years, I do wonder how she will cope academically if she were to take up the offer. As a side note, when things like this are discussed, boys are often a slightly separate matter as you can see from the numbers the previous poster mentioned. It’s the same when talking about auditions and offers. I remember one year the odds of a boy getting in after finals was almost 50% and the girls about 15% (if not less). Not to deter from the fact that it’s still extremely difficult for boys to get in but I don’t think it’s an equal comparison. It’s just the nature of ballet. I remember seeing a Vaganova documentary once and a young boy talking about this - how they know full well it’s an entirely different matter for girls who want a place. The odds are more stacked against girls overall just because of the numbers.

Last year results came out 7th May

Last year WL results came out 24th March. MA results came out 7th May.

Exactly this, 100%. I think this is the one that will be quite difficult to do and keep in mind when you’re just starting out, and it’s also hard to see beyond a school’s name I’m sure once you’re in. I am not in that situation but I would hold my hand up and say that if I was, I do worry that if my child told me s/he wants to leave, I think I’ll be tempted to say “are you sure? You do know hundreds of kids would love your place”. I think that will be the instinctive thought. I notice a very marked difference in the conversations I have with mums of those just about to start/in Year 7 to those whose DCs are in the latter years (years 10-11 and even upper school). This in itself is very telling, that after the sales pitch and the initial cosy bubble, the other things become more evident through the years.

I agree, no DC should ever live in false hope. Even up until year 11, they are still very young. Entering at year 7, there is a lot of uncertainties - physiques change, injuries happen, passions fade - BUT if schools really carefully consider their recruitment, monitoring, and feedback to these students, then no one should live in false hope for 3 or 5 years. What to me is harsher is being assessed out/not being offered the next stage after 3 years sometimes out of the blue, with very little or no clue of what’s to come. If schools give regular, honest, thorough and realistic feedback to students as they progress through the years, then these students and their parents can make informed decisions out of their own accord without having to be assessed out. And I always did wonder too whether being assured 3 or 5 years is a top consideration of any parent or child when faced with a choice between RBS and another school. If it were between two other schools perhaps but let’s face it, RBS is RBS and it’s easier to remember those who turned down places because it happens so rarely. To answer the original poster’s question, I have read of and heard of lots of success stories of dancers who have been assessed out or were told they weren’t good enough etc. It does depend on the student’s personality and constitution - are they the type so determined to want to to prove others wrong and still succeed and will they find excellent and nurturing training after or will the system affect or worse. ‘break’ them to the point that they would just want to quit dancing entirely.

However, those 5 years aren’t purely training, there is academics too as these vocational schools like to emphasise . 5 years is fairly normal in any other school and I would think that a disruption after 3 years has more impact than one after 5 years when they’ve done their GCSE’s and are more mature age-wise. A lot of kids in non-vocational schools would change educational institutions after year 11 whether it’s to go to upper school/6th form/college. I would say there’s a much smaller percentage having to move after year 9 and no matter how prepared you think a child is, it must take some adjustment to go from a boarding school “bubble” to a “normal” school. It must feel like a massive change from studying and living with say, 30 or less other kids in your year group to going to school where you’re one of maybe 150-200 in your year group. You also go from almost having this single focused goal to having to contend with thinking of more than one option.

I did wonder this myself. Oddly enough, I’m pretty sure I saw some internationals who seem to have visited WL not so long ago, outside usual audition dates. Perhaps they were international scholars as it looked like they stayed a few days. But then I saw some of the same ones in different schools the week after, sure I saw one at APG and one at Cranko. It must be quite disconcerting for the actual students of the school having new people in their classes come and go.

I’m sure I might be mistaken because I don’t have first hand experience but I assume at Y10 some of the main contenders would be from overseas. They’re at that age where their families would probably be more comfortable with their DCs boarding far from home and I’ve seen some exquisitely trained international dancers(who often come over for SIs here). I look at competitors at say YAGP, Prix de Lausanne, AGP, etc similar age to my DD but seem on a different level all together. If I were to hazard a guess, the ratio of UK vs international DCs inviter to a certain school’s finals for entry to Years 9/10/11 would be heavily skewed towards internationals. Correct me if I’m wrong, as I said, this is simply a guess. Perhaps the UK is slowly going that way and I’m noticing that every year, DCs who seem very extensively and intensively trained get those highly coveted Y7 places.

Freed does a stunning cap sleeve leotard, with adjustable pinch front. Very similar style to the RBS upper school uniform leotard. I can’t remember the style number but if you ask in-store in their shop in St Martin’s Lane, they usually have it in stock. Last time I purchased, it was only about £27. Very simple but an amazing fit and flattering leg line (definitely not too high like Degas).

London MA and SA assessment results are out now. You’re right @valentina, it was a brief email just saying they passed the assessment and that they’re invited for another year.

My DD loves Grishko, the Classic Excellence collection has a lot of styles that have an adjustable leg line. Attitude Diffusion is really good too and is often stocked in Freed (they had a lot on sale recently and most were only £20). Repetto and Wear Moi are also great.

That’s true. I do wonder (and this is just me doing my usual overthinking) if they put quite a few more on the waitlist this year from UK based applicants as a precautionary measure should travel restrictions somehow come into place again which will make it harder for international ones to travel over. They would then have a larger than usual pool of UK-based waitlist DCs to offer places to should overseas students be unable to take up their place. Business-wise, it makes sense although I assume RBS always had more DCs on waitlists anyway than can be offered places even in previous years regardless of travel situation. I don’t expect them to ever have places that won’t be filled even at short notice. Is this also the first year the intensives are under a new Head?

That’s what I was wondering too (though not personally involved in the matter). In previous years I’ve heard of quite a lot of no’s but this year, I haven’t seen nor heard of a single “no”, everyone seems (to me) to have been placed on the waitlist. In past years by this stage I’ve heard/seen of some no’s (even on this forum), a lot of waitlist and some yes’s. Just based on what I’ve personally seen and heard, that wait list seems especially long this year. The travel situation seems to have stabilised with restrictions either completely eased or being eased continually which means all those overseas offers should be fine to travel to the UK in the summer. I don’t think there will be a lot of movement in that list, certainly not to the extent of last year’s.

Thank you, that’s very interesting to know. I suppose with centres with more than one MA class it can also determine which class they’ll be placed in next year?

Okay, I thought there might be a report at least. We all received a phone call from the teacher before Christmas as a means of feedback but it was very early days then, they haven’t even finished the first term yet.

Sorry to revive this old thread but I didn’t want to start a new one when my query fits broadly under this. I was just wondering what happens after the MA assessment? First timer with any kind of RBS associates here. The emails regarding the assessment sound sufficiently ominous - like the offer of another year’s training is dependent on the assessment. I was just wondering, for those who have experience of MA: - how soon after the assessment do you usually get the results? - is it in the form of a detailed report? Are there marks? - do they generally assess out?

I think that’s usually the case. In my DD’s MA class there is a very small minority of students who weren’t JAs previously (off the top of my head I can only think of 3), but all 3 were at WL finals.

@NotadanceMa I can totally understand how this might be contentious, you’re right. However, on the contrary, I actually think the opposite most of the time (personally). I actually believe that those who have funding are very talented indeed and often very natural (there is none of the usual “practised/learned polish” I often spot in hot housed kids). I won’t mention specifics but I remember once having the opportunity to catch snippets of a class in a full time school. Even without a background in dancing, I easily spotted 2 students I guessed were on MDS. My friend confirmed this was the case and added that often you can easily spot these MDS students as they literally shine in classes. This is not a generalisation nor a stereotype but at that specific time and specific place, even I easily spotted these amazing MDS students out of the class.

I can totally sympathise with your “keep awake thought” @SJBalletand it’s totally understandable. Sadly it was this realisation that made me and my DD fall out of love with trying to audition for full time any time soon or at all. Thankfully, she’s still very much in love with dancing but knows she isn’t willing to spend as much time and money as others. I am all for people who still believe raw talent, physique and potential alone will get someone a place at these top schools but I think the reality is that a good deal of preparation is now involved (and a significant amount of money and time). I quietly cheer inside whenever I see someone who seems to have minimal training compared to others get finals etc. as I know how much natural talent and determination and grit they must have to go into these auditions knowing full well they’re against DCs who’ve had hours spent in class, coaching, conditioning (and these days, some even have some mental prep psychology sessions specially for these auditions!). Your DD should just enjoy these moments and not worry about competing as such. She’s already a JA so must already have something natural within her that caught RBS’ eye.

I’m with you on the lower threshold too. It just seems odd seeing students who might be on MDS who appear to have spent a lot on audition preparation, posting about lavish holidays, expensive dancewear, regular photo shoots - it seems to defeat the whole purpose of finding those who require financial assistance. I also find myself questioning what is included in the calculations - what about families who don’t have income declared in the U.K. but have properties and businesses overseas? Or those who get paid cash for additional jobs? Those who receive significant maintenance from a parent who doesn’t live with the rest of the family anymore? I guess it’s not my business but these are the things that occurred to me before. Even with Tring I think the only declaration on the application is a tick box indicating if you need funding. I don’t think checks are done before the actual funding audition? I could be wrong as I don’t know, but hypothetically speaking, can I tick that box even if my DC doesn’t need funding just to see if DC will be invited to the funding audition? Or are checks made prior to this to ensure those who are invited to the funding audition are actually only those who need and are eligible for funding?

I can totally see what you mean @BellaF and a part of me can’t help but think that too especially if they are already decided on accepting an offer already. However, I also think that these days a lot of these kids and their parents invest so much (money and time) in preparing for these auditions that they might as well show up to all even if they have an offer they’re intending to accept. For their dance schools too, it’s good marketing (“So and so got offers from these schools”). Yes, I’m just thinking of the last few years and I’m not sure how it would be easy to do that (move to another school), especially if funding is a consideration. Can’t think of many examples personally. if I was the school, I would be hesitant offering someone who’s already turned down an offer from me before. Perhaps I’m thinking of it too personally! I also did wonder as an outsider how MDS allocation per school is worked out. Ballet is such an expensive hobby and for those who have invested specifically into preparing their kids for auditioning, there must be a significant financial capability and output. I wonder how many students say in WL (and other schools) actually receive (or need) MDS or only need quite a small amount of funding. It’s one thing to say “over 90% of students receive funding for their studies” but another thing how much allocated. I know there have been numerous FOI requests over the years in relation to MDS and it’s allocation. Even then, I think there’s a lot of discussion on “income” that’s probably not considered on paper.

Sadly, in the past I’ve found that a lot offered WL still attend the Tring funding final and Elmhurst finals. I did wonder why because more often than not (in fact 100% of what I’ve witnessed), they always pick WL when offered. I never did understand why some would do this, I suppose it’s quite nice for them to be able to say “Received MDS offer from all 3 schools” or something. It’s not too bad for Tring because they have a recognised waitlist and it actually does have a lot of movement once students pick WL but it’s worse for say, Elmhurst when someone who already has an offer from WL (and fully intending to accept) still attend Elmhurst final and then suddenly get offered too effectively taking an Elmhurst MDS place from someone who potentially would have actually wanted and needed it. I’m not sure if Elmhurst has a waiting list as such?